10 Reasons NOT to Kill these Tyrant Jews

 

What a bizarre heading. Can you just imagine that on the front page of the tabloid papers. 

Only five years ago if someone had told me I would be writing an essay on ten specific reasons why I think we should not murder Jewish people – I would have said “You’re crackers mate”. But here is the reality slapped in my face.

 

This old awkward question “What we genna do with these pesky Jews?” Well what are we going do with them? This age-old Jewish question has to be addressed. This problem has to be addressed.

 

I received a call the other night/morning from someone we all know in the movement (no name at this point – no it wasn’t Mark Glenn) and we talked about this very question. He’s someone I greatly admire and respect, and someone who I’ve learnt from over the years. But we clashed diametrically with regards to a ‘solution’ to the Jewish perfidy. This spurned me on to creating this essay.

 

I was quite tired when he called me and felt I wasn’t being very articulate and assertive in my explanation. So I thought I would create another one of my “10” themed posts to succinctly point out why I disagree with the common theme of executing these tyrants.

 

I’ve heard so many people whom I look up to, all whistle this same tune with regards to killing them all, hanging them, electric chair, whatever. But I recoil every time. As much as I can understand them all presenting this as a solution; I know this is definitely not the root we should take, on every level.

 

Here are my ten reasons why I know we should not take this kill the Jews approach.

[these are all intrinsically linked and they all totally overlap]

 

1/. Thou shalt not kill.

It’s just wrong. Killing is killing is killing. It does not matter what crime they have done to us.

I’m not saying I would never kill. If I had to, I unfortunately would do. I would like to leave this world having not killed a soul – including an animal. However, I take the Gandhi stance. Non-violence as a primary option, and the use of violence when there is no other option. In self defense, and definitely in defense of others.

I believe we do have other options. Incarceration and removing these people from society. 100% preventing them from ever creating destruction and suffering in this world again.

 

 

2/. WE set the standards

We absolutely should not lower ourselves to their level. They are about revenge, hatred, slaughter, murder, malice and darkness – NOT US. We must maintain a moral, and spiritual precedence, no matter what they throw at us. No matter what! We must not allow ourselves to lean towards this dark side.

 

 

3/. The two R’s 

This is not a softy softy approach. This is exactly the opposite. My brother in arms the other night mentioned that my attitude was cowardly. I understand why he would say that. But I’m suggesting it takes a hell of a lot of courage to come from a place of love with our adversaries. It takes depth of character to not bite and not take the usual obvious root of reacting. To detach and respond to whatever is being thrown at us in whatever situation is bravery to the highest degree. Even if we fail, but our intent is there.

Compassion is strength, not weakness.

 

 

4/. Society’s foundations

What type of society are we going to bring our children into? A society where the rulers are savages, without self-control. Mass murderers – because that’s what it would have to be. Millions of people executed.

Who is going to decide who gets killed and who doesn’t? What type of death a person has. Where is the cut off point going to be? What right has one individual to kill another individual?

I just can’t get it.

Then after this mass cull, we are then going to build a new society. What kind of foundation is that to form our world on?

What lessons are we going to project to children and future generations? Are we going to have museums and history courses on this murderous frenzy? What ethical values are we going to set with this? How does this then filter down into our day-to-day values, when teaching children compassion, unconditional love, spirituality, the nature of consciousness, kindness, altruism, benevolence? These are hardcore values which every sane society must be built upon.

 

 

5/. Root cause

This revengeful execution will never get to the source of this age-old problem. It will initially give the impression it will have ‘sorted’ the problem. But it won’t. The root cause of this whole NWO/JWO is a dark force – IT IS NOT PEOPLE.

These elite Jews, or specifically the cult of judaism are simply the conduit, the vehicle for this darkness to operate. This dark satanic force or entity will just re-package itself and manifest itself in another form. In another religion, in another tribe, another ideology, another culture, or in a movement.

It has to some degree already done this. We all are infected by this darkness at varying levels.

If we think that all we need to do is rid the world of Jews and all our problems will be over – we are deluded.

The root cause is demonic entities. The dark force. Satan.

Our real hidden enemies are within us and around us. We are battling with them all the time and what ALL the great mystics, saints, prophets and genuine gurus have warned us about since day dot. These hidden enemies are: ego, attachment, greed, lust/false desires, false fears, deep-rooted insecurities, false identities, separatism, etc.

All ‘the Jews’ the dark force has done is manipulate these weaknesses within us.

 

 

6/. Justice will be met

If it is justice we need to see; then surely the best way to get these people to pay the price for their crimes is to let them witness a successful Gentile society free from this judaic demonic influences. This will be rubbed in their noses EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THEIR LIVES. Now that is punishment. They will wish to die. They will have so much remorse, envy, disheartenment, regret, angst and be utterly deflated. “The goy finally won!”

Now how about that for justice. They would be made to reimburse the damage they have done to society. They will be made to pay every day for their collective crimes. They will not get away with what they have done. But they will be punished in such a way that we will not lose our dignity in how we deliver this justice. Anything to the contrary would mean they would have ultimately won.

 

 

7/. Harm others – harm ourselves.

If we murder others, we are murdering ourselves. If we enforce suffering on others from a place of anger, revenge, hate – we are inflicting this on ourselves. This premise is old as the hills and yet we never seem to grasp this ancient wisdom. Despite the crass new age term – we indeed are all one. Individual droplets making up an ocean of consciousness. The consistent message of all the pure spiritual doctrines.

 

 

8/. It’ll be ugly

Very simply put – it will be one the most despicable acts in recent history. Lets think about it. It will be organised mass murder.

Lets have a look at the logistics – so once we’ve rounded up all the known criminals and their counterparts, we then put them in death detention centers. We systematically build murdering centers with a whole variety of execution chambers and facilities. All under the guise of “Well it’s dirty work, but hey someone’s got to do it”

This will be abhorrent. This would be a regression in humanity. We would have reached the lowest of the lowest on every level of society. Again, who makes all these finite decisions? Who inacts them? Who would want to inact them? It would be very very ugly. Would we be filming all of these individual deaths for prosperity?

Killers killing killers.

Think of the images of how Gaddafi was distastefully murdered in the street. Even though he may have originally served this beast. Did this human being deserve to be paraded in the streets for the world to see in such a degrading way? For people to rejoice and gloat over another human being suffering, and being murdered?? Have we reached such archaic savagery?

Or is it ok because we are going to clinically murder our victims?

I’m suggesting if we take this root, this would be a very dark stain on our new found society.

 

 

9/. In their shoes

We would do exactly the same had we been born into this cult. If we had had a judaic upbringing, Jewish teachers, Jewish domestic life, Jewish scholarly training, Jewish foods, music, israeli (occupied Palestine) holidays, prayers, literature, culture. The entire Jewish IDENTITY rammed down our throats, and embedded into our cells and psyche – we would be up to all these shenanigans.

How could we not?

This is NOT making excuses for their collective behaviour. This is just being blatantly honest. This is realism.

We have to show levels of maturity and look at this objectively. Then we can effectively deal with these issues – permanently.

 

 

10/. Our role

By carrying out this proposed mass slaughter on these criminals it is a way of dumping our responsibility, on why we are in this mess. It is partly our fault. We must be big boys and girls and begin to take responsibility for our complacency.

We must take partial blame for allowing the bully to bully us.

We CHOSE to get drunk, COMPLACENTLY left the back door open, fell asleep on the sofa in a drunken stupor. Then the burglar strolled in, shot the dog, raped our daughter and stole all our goodies. Now we’ve woken up with a sore head blaming it ALL on the burglar. 

Once we can be detached enough to realise we ALL have played our individual roles in allowing this beast to get out of hand, then we are on the road to sorting this mess out – once and for all.

 

 

Summary

1/. Thou shalt not kill

2/. WE set the standards

3/. The two R’s

4/. Society’s foundations

5/. Root cause

6/. Justice will be met

7/. Harm others – harm ourselves

8/. It’ll be ugly

9/. In their shoes

10/. Our role

 

Max French mentioned this essay at 147 mins:

http://blogtalk.vo.llnwd.net/o23/show/3/886/show_3886227.mp3

 

Related essays

A Man to Match His Mountains

https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/2012/07/11/a-man-to-match-his-mountains/#more-1511

Digger Dictatorship

https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/2012/09/10/digger-dictatorship/

Kill the Killers

https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/2012/08/29/kill-the-killers/

Hidden Enemies

https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/2012/08/08/hidden-enemies/#more-1783

HATE (page)

https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/hate/

Our role (page)

Previous Post
Next Post
Leave a comment

17 Comments

  1. I think relocation is the answer and considering they are gods chosen people they should be fine on the moon.

    Reply
  2. Digs! Next time up, why not discuss the tens of millions reasons they should be killed for all the tens of millions of people they’ve killed in the false flag wars and with poison medicine? Or at least do a survey of all the categories in which they have manipulated others into doing their killing for them? Or (I’ll stop soon), how about the different ways they have already devised to kill millions more in our immediate future? Where do you want to start? WW3? Radiation? Alzheimer chemtrails? Gardasil? Checkpoints? Cops on steroids trained in Israel? Drones? Abortions? Diseases passed by homosexuals? Antidepressants? Electromagnetic autosuggestions making people commit suicide? Not to mention the desperate old people whose money has all been stolen and removed to Israel. And of course, their two favorite methods: rabbinical beheadings and mass starvations. All these are coming soon to a neighborhood near you. OK, I’ll stop now.

    Reply
    • Hi John,

      Welcome to DFT.

      I hear your sentiments entirely. You are right in everything you say. I was waiting for this counter argument :-). And as you mentioned we could go on and on and on.

      However, no matter what they do to my loved ones or myself…. coming to a neighbourhood near me; I will only try to prevent these actions with all my energy, to try to contain this beast. But my feelings at present are that I don’t want any part in executions. I see execution is just a euphemism for planned killing – murder.

      I know that violence, killing, murder, executions, revenge has never ever provided us positive substantial solutions throughout history; it has only given us the illusion of solutions. Before long, the root cause sneaks up on us again, just in a different format.

      I think we’re just going to have to respectfully agree to disagree on this one my friend.

      It may not even get to this stage anyway John with these maniac’s Samson option.

      All that matters is what we have in common, that we are swimming together and have camaraderie; than any peripheral differences we may have. We can’t agree on everything.

      “Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only Light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that”

      ~ MLK junior

      Thank you for contributing.

      With respect and support

      Digger

      Reply
  3. Have you ever seen a troll or devil reform? Moral uprightness is seen as a weakness.

    We can be ‘dead right’ and morally upright.

    Agreed, INDEFINITE DETENTION with no possibility of release. Where we draw the line in incarceration?

    Make lists of the trolls, devils, deceivers. Those lists will be useful, as the sleeping giant awakens, to identify the enemies of humanity.

    And, insofar as we each have been corrupted, are we really so corrupt as to have responsibility for the existence of the devils by way of our own failings?

    We have FEMA camps. Let’s use them.

    Reply
  4. I’m afraid I’m with John’s argument over this one – but that’s just anger for everything John listed. However, I know that when it comes to it, we will be lucky to have any choices at all. Our own kinsmen around us of all colours and creeds who are still sheep or even half woken-up – sadly still the majority – will unwittingly see us as their enemy along with any Muslim/Christian who steps out of line or indeed any Muslim at all.

    A Jew’s own words of what he would do with any competitor – not an enemy or even anyone he knew or who’d wronged him in any way – just someone who was getting close to him in business “I’d rip off his head, piss down the hole and stamp on his grave”. That’s the mentality of the beast – we have no value to them if we’re not prepare to serve them. They do have the upper hand right now, and yes we have to still work away at wakening up the sheep.

    I think your ethics are perfect and work for you and I also would have to admit I cannot see a situation where I would actually kill someone who wasn’t actually attacking me or those around me. But it’s like having dry rot in your house, you just have to cut the mould out and burn it, it’s no good being sentimental about it and expecting it to change. You would still have to feed the rot and clean up after it. Could I kill this mould all around us and have I the power to do it? We aren’t programmed in the same way as they are.

    The Jews who are controlling us and positively harming us every single day, have no soul or compassion for any Gentile on the planet. Digger – you sent us the Lasha link with the picture of the Palestinian child with his arm ripped off for throwing stones. Look at it again and remember how the Jew reacts – an eye for an eye, but he will have an eye for an eyelash.

    We need to stick together and back each other up, but at the same time appreciate we have ideals and opinions that differ and respect that. The difficulty of choosing between a pacifist or a non-pacifist approach is theoretical and each circumstance is different, and it will be a luxury to be in that position. I hope all of us have it.

    Reply
    • Thank you Spicegirl for your input once again.

      Firstly you have admitted your alignment with John is coming from a place of ‘anger’. This may seem natural, and I certainly do feel this too. But this is REACTIONAL. It is not from a spiritually detached RESPONSIVE position. Although I agree with everything you say regarding the situation is correct.

      Your example of this Jew’s rant is typical. We all could provide a hundred examples of this behaviour. But this is irrespective of how we should respond spiritually. It’s a case of NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO OR SAY. We deal with the situation, maturely and objectively and effectively. Not from a place of angry, revengeful, hateful lust for murder (execution).

      With respect, I do not buy into this analogy of dry rot, or cancer, or any other inanimate material element; simply because we are dealing with HUMAN BEINGS. Despite any demonic influences, despite their evil-doings, they are sentient beings. They must be dealt with sufficiently; but from a place of compassion and humanistic ethical strength – otherwise we are no better than them.

      “The Jews who are controlling us and positively harming us every single day, have no soul or compassion for any Gentile on the planet.” This is irrelevant to how we should spiritually RESPOND. I don’t give a damn how a Jew reacts or what a Jew has done, or what a Jew’s philosophy is as far as an eye-for-an-eye. It only matters how we CHOOSE to RESPOND in an effective and spiritual position.

      Please invest some time in reading about Non Violence. With respect Spicegirl, you do not understand the principles of NV. Most people don’t. NV is diametrically opposed to pacifism. NV is activism in every sense of the word. NV is unadulterated bravery! NV principles have been polluted and warped like everything. We then repeat these and think we understand it.

      Yes I agree we will all have differences in opinions. Just so long as we are swimming together and can show levels of camaraderie.

      Please read this book and other books on NV resistance. You will be shocked and amazed at it’s subtle powers and effectiveness.
      https://diggerfortruth.wordpress.com/2012/07/11/a-man-to-match-his-mountains/#more-1511

      Thank you once again for your contribution.

      Reply
  5. Yukon Jack

     /  October 8, 2012

    There is a middle path between doing nothing vs. killing supremacist Jews. Arrest them and put them in re-education camps. But in order to do so, we must recognize our spirituality vs. those spellbound by Jew myth and create a philosophy of containment:

    1. Society gets clear about the Jewish problem, it elects a nationalist leader or starts a nationalist/populist political movement. This will happen only if things get so bad that normalcy is overturned and people are forced to do something. The collapse will force change, it always does, it is part of the process. Strong nationalistic leaders will rise when the depression caused by Jewish debt money collapses.

    2. Then these new leaders write papers then pass laws about the problem, obviously the ownership and control of the mass media is going to change hands. The media will be enlisted to broadcast their crimes against humanity and how they infiltrate and control, the History channel broadcasts 24-7 Holocaust revisionism.

    3. Next you “arrest” their behavior, you physically stop them from harming others by putting them in jail/camps. Their laptops seized and their network investigated, all of their so-called holy books seized including the Bible.

    4. Jewish literature is a highly infectious memetic virus, it has to be treated just the same as a dangerous biological virus. If an untrained mind reads the Torah/Talmud then it gets infected and spreads the infection.

    The Jews are well aware that this is coming so they have a trump card called the Samson Option, amongst the patriot movement it is now believed that Israel used container sized diplomatic pouches and other means to pre-positioned nukes in major western cities. If we move against them (which we will be eventually forced to do so for our own survival) then will destroy civilization.

    So Digger, is my numbered outline of the standard revolutionary change realistic? Do we stand a chance when they own the money, the stocks of industry, the medical and big pharma industry, the legal system, and even the massmind of the indoctrinated Christian sheeple?

    Not a chance which is why we should all listen to JB Campbell and John Kaminski. What is going to happen is mass chaos because the majority of Christians are never going to figure out who the enemy is. They will defend their Bibles even though the Bible is the primary cause of their enslavement. Even you quote it, “thou shall not kill”, the demeaning philosophy of the oppressed slave is to not fight back. The Jews are killing us, we have the right of self defense, we have the moral right and obligation to kill them. The highest morality of those oppressed is to stop, arrest, or even kill the psychopaths.

    Most Christians are idiots disguised as morons. Sorry but that is a true statement. Most Christian still believe the official 9112001 fable, they still listen to Kosher Alex Jonestein, they still go to church and worship a Jewish god, they still have no idea that Israel did 911. When they comment on these essays and forums they quote the Bible. They don’t get it and as long as they are mind spelled by the Bible they will never get it. They are sheep going to the slaughter.

    PS: They own us because they own our god, which is myth and according to Larken Rose the Christian and Jews are actually worshiping the state (and its power and authority):

    Message to the Voting Cattle – Larken Rose

    Reply
    • Yukon,

      Welcome to DFT.

      Thank you for your detailed contribution to this post.

      Respectfully I disagree with you – for the 10 reasons I have outlined …and more.

      As much as I respect John Kaminski for his incredible talent and industrious efforts over the years, I’m not alignment with him on this one issue. I really would advise people not to listen to this ‘kill the Jews’ message – it will be our ultimate downfall. We do have another option.

      Despite any differences we all may have on varying topics – our main theme should be unison. We have to learn to unite and offer camaraderie….just like our adversaries have.

      In kindness

      Digger

      Reply
  6. Yukon Jack

     /  October 9, 2012

    Digger,

    Thank you for the reply and allowing me to comment. Thank you for writing this essay, as it gave me pleasure to think about this. So what are we going to do? That is the 6 million dollar question.

    Well I have been discussing this with my hunting buddies for decades, many of us knew this had to come to a head and so the current situation is no surprise. I enjoy watching it unfold. What is the antagonist going to do to us as we wake up and how are we going to respond?

    We are all going to die, the question is when and how. They are accelerating the death process, this is clear, war disease, laced food and vaccinations, spreading DU and they did Fukushima. They are buying 1.7 billion rounds of ammo thus far. The are building camps, they are cornering the food supply and passing laws prohibiting hoarding. Prepping is mainstream, people see what is happening and they are preparing.

    I live in the wilderness, I have a rifle and a knife, I like roughing it, they aren’t much threat to me. But I still come on the net and comment, I do care about my nation and culture, I hope to play a major role in the revolution. So do you and John Kaminski, Mark Glenn, John Friend, ZCF and many others. In fact we are the revolutionary thought leaders, that is what we are doing, we are making a pathway for consciousness to flow.

    What we decide is what goes. The Universe wants to shift, the Jews are in the way of higher consciousness, our job is to find the path, trail blaze a new solution, cut through the road block of Jewish supremacism. Hitler tried and unfortunately he failed, as a result the Jews remained for another century, and look at what they have done: millions killed, tortured, raped, homes destroyed, people displaced, depleted uranium everywhere and worse of all the Jews formed a state, they have the holy of holies, and they are damned determined to sell and use nuclear weapons.

    So let’s decide not to kill them. OK, your the boss, now what? Do you really think not killing them is a good solution? I might humbly suggest that Hitler’s failure might be the the critical failure of white gentiles to preserve their DNA bloodline.

    If we fail Digger it could mean the end of the human race as we know it, the supremacist Jews are getting very close in forcing the spirit out of the human body and turning everyone tax slave Zombies dumbed down robots who do their bidding. Are we free thinkers the remnant, that last one percent who try to rescue humanity from total ruin?

    Reply
    • Hi Yukon,

      I’ll do my best to respond to your intelligent comment; but please bare with me, I’ve just come back from work and haven’t stopped physically slaving all day and I’m very knackered 🙂

      All I can simply say is I believe EVERYTHING in our lives is a spiritual experience – I know this may make your eyes role whilst you say “Ohh no – here we go with another fluffy spiritual answer”; but I look at all of this destruction and mayhem in this light now.

      I also know in my heart we absolutely have an alternative to complete and utter destruction. WE ACTUALLY DO HAVE A CHANCE OF PULLING THIS AROUND. They are not demi-gods, they make mistakes, big big clangers and we are waking up.

      Yukon there is a conscious awakening. Things are moving in our direction, it’s just that it so subliminal, low key, behind the scenes. But the Truth tsunami is building and building slowly as an undercurrent. These big boys know this. We have to prove to God/the universal powers that WE REALLY DO WANT FREEDOM and a better world. Then when we show that FULL commitment, then a magic will happen. This is my Truth.

      Winning spirit comrade – all the way; seeped in realism, impregnated with conscious spiritualism I feel is our key.

      Sorry for ramble, but very very tired.

      Thank you again for contributing.

      Digger

      Reply
  7. Reblogged this on akkaoldfart.

    Reply
  8. russ hook

     /  May 15, 2013

    To start with the”Jew” is not the true enemy of mankind. The truth is, it is US! WE have allowed ourselves to become slaves by OUR own volition, SELFISHNESS, and cowardice. WHO enforces the JEW laws? WE DO! WE have to BE the change we want to see in our reality. WE have to band together and support anyone in our community who is being foreclosed or wrongfully arrested. The JEW is a natural parasite/COWARD, and will flee when opposed. I know from personal experience. There is an expression in the 12 Step Program, “WHO is sicker, the abuser, or the one who continually accepts the abuse?”
    Even the animals are smarter than us at times…watch this incredible video. We are the buffalo and the Jew is the lion.

    Reply
  9. Checkmate

     /  May 15, 2013

    Digger –

    I learn a lot from your articles and am encouraged by the message. You are right: Judaism is the root of the Jewish scourge. But, it is obvious that genetics plays a big part in the Jewish behavior. All races have inherent unlearned distinguishing behaviors. Jews (those born into the Judaic structure) have been genetically conditioned for thousands of years… be they Semites, Sephardi, or Khazars. Just like any breed of cattle or k-9s, they have inbred behavior. Unfortunately, the Jew has all that is bad bred into him.

    Whether to kill the or not the kill them is not the answer. They are BOTH pipe dreams. At this late juncture it would be impossible to do either as a blanket answer to THE problem. Jews have successfully splintered humanity with their multicultural meme. There is no racial unity besides Jewish unity left on Earth. You already pointed out why we cannot kill Jews. And, we can’t just NOT kill them while they characteristically morph into every degenerate activity known and yet unknown.

    The only way to move forward is to kill them for their crimes. Jews must be reduced from within the judicial systems of the world… (well, in all systems of the world). There must be gallows built at all the governmental centers of each town. The US Capitol should be the first. The hangings should begin after trials for those who have betrayed the public trust in ANY way. This would pretty much include all Jews within government, and all their lapdog Gentiles. A person with the public given power to effect the lives of so many by controlling the course of society must be held accountable to the greatest degree.

    There are laws in place right now to distinguish these crimes. There is such a government abuse and corruption problem now that most honest people would agree to such severe punishment. Death is the ONLY deterrent to their aberrant behavior.

    Next…… voluntary racial segregation should be facilitated. Then the rats could not hide within the shadows of humanity.

    Reply
    • Thank you for your thoughts, but I wholeheartedly disagree, for the reasons I’ve stated in this essay. I agree though with your meme theme. I have a post on this subject coming up soon (next few days). Have so many posts from my week off, I want to pace them.

      Thank you for contributing.

      Reply
  10. shadowmasterminds

     /  August 13, 2013

    No matter how much you want to prevent their deaths, the Jewish race cannot be tamed and they all have to die. You’d best pick a choice. The Bible won’t save anyone this time.

    Reply
  11. Checkmate

     /  August 14, 2013

    Jews MUST be extracted from white European society. Their MO is infiltrate, exploit, and destroy from within. They can NEVER be trusted. Hitler was right with his idea of a Juden quarantine on Madagascar. Quarantine is the only solution besides death.

    Multiculturalism of white countries is the Joos’ shield. People of common race and culture should separate from others and reestablish harmonious societies without the Juden meddling. That is the only way to avoid the darkness that the Roman Flavian created Jesus Christ warned about.

    Reply
  1. 10 Reasons NOT to Kill these Tyrant Jews « The Ugly Truth

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: